Lord Blackadder
Aug 10, 01:10 PM
There's nothing really sinister about it. It's just harder to measure and to this point, there's been no point in trying to measure it in comparison to cars.
I understand that they have to be measured differently, but doesn't it make sense that they be compared apples-to-apples (if possible) to the vehicles they are intended to replace?
Most people do ignore it to a large extent, because they say "heck, if it costs me $1 to go 40 miles on electric vs. $2.85 to go 40 miles on gasoline, then that *must* be more efficient in some way". And they are probably right. Economics do tend to line up with efficiency (or government policy).
That is true, but as you pointed out later "green", "efficient", "alternative[to oil imports]" are not all the same thing. Perhaps they are more green but less efficient, or less efficient but more green. Just being more efficient in terms of bang for buck is not necessarily also good from an environmental or alternative energy standpoint. But you are right that the end cost per mile is going to weigh heavily when it comes to consumer acceptance of new types of autos.
I think it's great that European car manufacturers have invested heavily in finding ways to make more fuel efficient cars. And they have their governments to thank for that by making sure that diesel is given a tax advantage vs. gasoline. About 15 years ago, Europe recognized the potential for efficiency in diesels to ultimately outweigh the environmental downside. It was a short-term risk that paid off and now that they have shifted the balance, Europe is tightening their diesel emissions standards to match the US. Once that happens, I'm sure there will a huge market for TDIs in the US and we'll have a nice competitive landscape for driving-up fuel efficiency with diesels vs. gasoline hybrids vs. extended range electrics.
I would argue that Europe's switch to diesels did not involve quite the environmental tradeoff you imply - in the 70s we in the US were driving cars with huge gasoline engines, and to this day diesel regulation for trucks in this country is pretty minimal. Our emissions were probably world-leading then - partially due to the fact that we had the most cars on the roads by far. The problem lies (in my heavily biased opinion) in ignorance. People see smoke coming off diesel exhausts and assume they are dirtier than gasoline engines. But particulate pollution is not necessarily worse, just different. People are not educated about the differerence between gasoline engine pollution and diesel engine pollution. Not to mention the fact that diesel engines don't puff black smoke like they did in the 70s. I'm not arguing that diesels are necessarily cleaner, but they are arguably no worse than gasoline engines and are certainly more efficient.
Whether or not it's "greener" depends upon your definition of green. If you're worried about smog and air quality, then you might make different decisions than if you are worried about carbon dioxide and global warming. Those decisions may also be driven by where you live and where the electricity comes from.
A lot of people in the US (and I assume around the world) are also concerned about energy independence. For those people, using coal to power an electric car is more attractive than using foreign diesel. Any cleaner? Probably not, but probably not much dirtier and certainly cheaper. Our government realizes that we can always make power plants cleaner in the future through regulation, just as Europe realized they could make diesels cleaner in the future through regulation. Steven Chu is no dummy.
It's a fair point. Given the choice, I would prioritize moving to domestic fuel sources in the short term over a massive "go green" (over all alse) campaign.
Which is why we will need new metrics that actually make sense for comparing gasoline to pure electric, perhaps localized to account for the source of power in your area. For example, when I lived in Chicago, the electric was 90% nuclear. It's doesn't get any cleaner than that from an air quality / greenhouse gas standpoint. However, if you're on the east coast, it's probably closer to 60% coal.
I agree completely. The transition needs to be made as transparent as possible. People need to know the source, efficiency and cleanliness of their power source so that they can make informed choices.
I think you're smart enough to know that it's more efficient, but you're not willing to cede that for the sake of your argument, but I encourage you to embrace the idea that we should have extended range electrics *and* clean diesels *and* gasoline hybrids. There's more than one way to skin a cat.
I'm not trying to sound stubborn, I simply have not come accross the numbers anywhere. I don't get paid to do this research, ya know. I do it while hiding from the boss. ;)
I've seen that propaganda FUD (fear, uncertainty and doubt) before. It doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Let's consider that the power grid can handle every household running an air conditioner on a hot summer day. That's approximately 2000-3500 watts per household per hour during daytime peak load (on top of everything else on the grid.) Now let's consider that a Volt (or equivalent) has a 16kw battery that charges in 8 hours. That's 200 watts per hour, starting in the evening, or the equivalent of (4) 50 watt light bulbs. This is not exactly grid-overwhelming load.
I'm no math whiz (or electrician), but wouldn't 200 watts/hr * 8 hours = 1.6kw, rather than 16kw? I thought you'd need 2kw/hr * 8hrs to charge a 16kw battery.
It's not that I don't think people have looked into this stuff, it's just that I myself have no information on just how much energy the Volt uses and how much the grid can provide. In the short term, plugin hybrids are few in number and I don't see it being an issue. But it's something we need to work out in the medium/long term.
Or, some would argue that the biggest thing that Americans have trouble with are a few people telling them what the majority should or shouldn't do - which is, as it seems, the definition of "Communism", but I wouldn't go so far as to say that. :)
Communism means nothing in this country, because we've been so brainwashed by Cold War/right-wing rhetoric that, like "freedom", the term has been stolen for propaganda purposes until the original meanings have become lost in a massive sea of BS. I was using it for it's hyperbole value. :D
Most people do indeed realize that they can get better mileage with a smaller car and could "get by" with a much smaller vehicle. They choose not to and that is their prerogative. If the majority wants to vote for representatives who will make laws that increase fuel mileage standards, which in turn require automakers to sell more small cars - or find ways to make them more efficient - that is also their prerogative. (And, in case you haven't noticed, in the last major US election, voters did indeed vote for a party that is increasing CAFE standards.)
Well, that's the nature of democracy. But it's not so much a question of the fact that people realize a smaller car is more efficient, but a question of whether people really care about efficiency. I have recently lived in Nevada and Alaska, two states whose residents are addicted to burning fuel. Seemingly everyone has a pickup, RV and four-wheelers. Burning fuel is not just part of the daily transportation routine - it's a lifestyle.
CAFE standardsAnd if it's important to you, you should do your part and ride a bike to work or buy a TDI, or lobby your congressman for reduced emissions requirements, or stand up on a soap box and preach about the advantages of advanced clean diesel technology. All good stuff.
I walk to work. I used to commute 34 miles a day (total), and while I never minded it, I felt pretty liberated being able to ditch the car for my daily commute. Four years of walking and I don't want to go back. I love cars and motorsport, and I don't consider myself an environmentalist, but I got to the point where I realized that I was driving a lot more than necessary. That realization came when I moved out of a suburb (where you have to drive to get anywhere) and into first a small town and then a biggish city. In both cases it became possible to walk almost everywhere I needed to go. A tank of fuel lasted over a month (or longer) rather than a week from my highway-commuting days. And I lost weight as I hauled by fat backside around on foot. ;)
I won't be in the market for another car for a few years, and my current car (a Subaru) is not very fuel efficient - but then again it has literally not been driven more than half a dozen times in the last six months. When the time comes to replace it I'll be looking for something affordable (ruling out the Volt) but efficiency will be high on the priority list, followed by green-ness.
I wonder if all of you people who are proposing a diesel/diesel hybrid are Europeans, because in America, diesel is looked at as smelly and messy - it's what the trucks with black smoke use.
<snip>
As far as the Chevy Volt goes, I just don't like the name... but the price is right assuming they can get it into the high $20,000's rather quickly.
I'm an American, and yes I've seen the trucks with black smoke. We just need to discard that preconception. This isn't 1973 anymore. We also need to tighten up emissions regualtion on trucks.
The Volt is a practical car by all acoioutns, but it costs way too much. The battery is the primary contributing factor, I've heard that it costs somewhere between $8-15k by itself. Hopefully after GM has been producing such batteries for a few years the cost will drop substantially.
I understand that they have to be measured differently, but doesn't it make sense that they be compared apples-to-apples (if possible) to the vehicles they are intended to replace?
Most people do ignore it to a large extent, because they say "heck, if it costs me $1 to go 40 miles on electric vs. $2.85 to go 40 miles on gasoline, then that *must* be more efficient in some way". And they are probably right. Economics do tend to line up with efficiency (or government policy).
That is true, but as you pointed out later "green", "efficient", "alternative[to oil imports]" are not all the same thing. Perhaps they are more green but less efficient, or less efficient but more green. Just being more efficient in terms of bang for buck is not necessarily also good from an environmental or alternative energy standpoint. But you are right that the end cost per mile is going to weigh heavily when it comes to consumer acceptance of new types of autos.
I think it's great that European car manufacturers have invested heavily in finding ways to make more fuel efficient cars. And they have their governments to thank for that by making sure that diesel is given a tax advantage vs. gasoline. About 15 years ago, Europe recognized the potential for efficiency in diesels to ultimately outweigh the environmental downside. It was a short-term risk that paid off and now that they have shifted the balance, Europe is tightening their diesel emissions standards to match the US. Once that happens, I'm sure there will a huge market for TDIs in the US and we'll have a nice competitive landscape for driving-up fuel efficiency with diesels vs. gasoline hybrids vs. extended range electrics.
I would argue that Europe's switch to diesels did not involve quite the environmental tradeoff you imply - in the 70s we in the US were driving cars with huge gasoline engines, and to this day diesel regulation for trucks in this country is pretty minimal. Our emissions were probably world-leading then - partially due to the fact that we had the most cars on the roads by far. The problem lies (in my heavily biased opinion) in ignorance. People see smoke coming off diesel exhausts and assume they are dirtier than gasoline engines. But particulate pollution is not necessarily worse, just different. People are not educated about the differerence between gasoline engine pollution and diesel engine pollution. Not to mention the fact that diesel engines don't puff black smoke like they did in the 70s. I'm not arguing that diesels are necessarily cleaner, but they are arguably no worse than gasoline engines and are certainly more efficient.
Whether or not it's "greener" depends upon your definition of green. If you're worried about smog and air quality, then you might make different decisions than if you are worried about carbon dioxide and global warming. Those decisions may also be driven by where you live and where the electricity comes from.
A lot of people in the US (and I assume around the world) are also concerned about energy independence. For those people, using coal to power an electric car is more attractive than using foreign diesel. Any cleaner? Probably not, but probably not much dirtier and certainly cheaper. Our government realizes that we can always make power plants cleaner in the future through regulation, just as Europe realized they could make diesels cleaner in the future through regulation. Steven Chu is no dummy.
It's a fair point. Given the choice, I would prioritize moving to domestic fuel sources in the short term over a massive "go green" (over all alse) campaign.
Which is why we will need new metrics that actually make sense for comparing gasoline to pure electric, perhaps localized to account for the source of power in your area. For example, when I lived in Chicago, the electric was 90% nuclear. It's doesn't get any cleaner than that from an air quality / greenhouse gas standpoint. However, if you're on the east coast, it's probably closer to 60% coal.
I agree completely. The transition needs to be made as transparent as possible. People need to know the source, efficiency and cleanliness of their power source so that they can make informed choices.
I think you're smart enough to know that it's more efficient, but you're not willing to cede that for the sake of your argument, but I encourage you to embrace the idea that we should have extended range electrics *and* clean diesels *and* gasoline hybrids. There's more than one way to skin a cat.
I'm not trying to sound stubborn, I simply have not come accross the numbers anywhere. I don't get paid to do this research, ya know. I do it while hiding from the boss. ;)
I've seen that propaganda FUD (fear, uncertainty and doubt) before. It doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Let's consider that the power grid can handle every household running an air conditioner on a hot summer day. That's approximately 2000-3500 watts per household per hour during daytime peak load (on top of everything else on the grid.) Now let's consider that a Volt (or equivalent) has a 16kw battery that charges in 8 hours. That's 200 watts per hour, starting in the evening, or the equivalent of (4) 50 watt light bulbs. This is not exactly grid-overwhelming load.
I'm no math whiz (or electrician), but wouldn't 200 watts/hr * 8 hours = 1.6kw, rather than 16kw? I thought you'd need 2kw/hr * 8hrs to charge a 16kw battery.
It's not that I don't think people have looked into this stuff, it's just that I myself have no information on just how much energy the Volt uses and how much the grid can provide. In the short term, plugin hybrids are few in number and I don't see it being an issue. But it's something we need to work out in the medium/long term.
Or, some would argue that the biggest thing that Americans have trouble with are a few people telling them what the majority should or shouldn't do - which is, as it seems, the definition of "Communism", but I wouldn't go so far as to say that. :)
Communism means nothing in this country, because we've been so brainwashed by Cold War/right-wing rhetoric that, like "freedom", the term has been stolen for propaganda purposes until the original meanings have become lost in a massive sea of BS. I was using it for it's hyperbole value. :D
Most people do indeed realize that they can get better mileage with a smaller car and could "get by" with a much smaller vehicle. They choose not to and that is their prerogative. If the majority wants to vote for representatives who will make laws that increase fuel mileage standards, which in turn require automakers to sell more small cars - or find ways to make them more efficient - that is also their prerogative. (And, in case you haven't noticed, in the last major US election, voters did indeed vote for a party that is increasing CAFE standards.)
Well, that's the nature of democracy. But it's not so much a question of the fact that people realize a smaller car is more efficient, but a question of whether people really care about efficiency. I have recently lived in Nevada and Alaska, two states whose residents are addicted to burning fuel. Seemingly everyone has a pickup, RV and four-wheelers. Burning fuel is not just part of the daily transportation routine - it's a lifestyle.
CAFE standardsAnd if it's important to you, you should do your part and ride a bike to work or buy a TDI, or lobby your congressman for reduced emissions requirements, or stand up on a soap box and preach about the advantages of advanced clean diesel technology. All good stuff.
I walk to work. I used to commute 34 miles a day (total), and while I never minded it, I felt pretty liberated being able to ditch the car for my daily commute. Four years of walking and I don't want to go back. I love cars and motorsport, and I don't consider myself an environmentalist, but I got to the point where I realized that I was driving a lot more than necessary. That realization came when I moved out of a suburb (where you have to drive to get anywhere) and into first a small town and then a biggish city. In both cases it became possible to walk almost everywhere I needed to go. A tank of fuel lasted over a month (or longer) rather than a week from my highway-commuting days. And I lost weight as I hauled by fat backside around on foot. ;)
I won't be in the market for another car for a few years, and my current car (a Subaru) is not very fuel efficient - but then again it has literally not been driven more than half a dozen times in the last six months. When the time comes to replace it I'll be looking for something affordable (ruling out the Volt) but efficiency will be high on the priority list, followed by green-ness.
I wonder if all of you people who are proposing a diesel/diesel hybrid are Europeans, because in America, diesel is looked at as smelly and messy - it's what the trucks with black smoke use.
<snip>
As far as the Chevy Volt goes, I just don't like the name... but the price is right assuming they can get it into the high $20,000's rather quickly.
I'm an American, and yes I've seen the trucks with black smoke. We just need to discard that preconception. This isn't 1973 anymore. We also need to tighten up emissions regualtion on trucks.
The Volt is a practical car by all acoioutns, but it costs way too much. The battery is the primary contributing factor, I've heard that it costs somewhere between $8-15k by itself. Hopefully after GM has been producing such batteries for a few years the cost will drop substantially.
countrydweller
Jul 21, 09:28 AM
Why are Apple on a witch hunt?
Apple should concentrate on fixing their problem instead of finger pointing and deflecting the issue onto other companies. We already know the problem isn't as severe on other devices as the iPhone 4.
We do? You've tested them all?
Apple should concentrate on fixing their problem instead of finger pointing and deflecting the issue onto other companies. We already know the problem isn't as severe on other devices as the iPhone 4.
We do? You've tested them all?
Eidorian
Nov 17, 04:15 PM
Link?
This is the first I've heard the story put that way. I've many times heard it said that Apple has kept versions of the Mac OS running on different CPUs in their labs, especially since the switch to OS X. Do you have any evidence to back up your supposition?http://lowendmac.com/orchard/05/0613.html
This is the first I've heard the story put that way. I've many times heard it said that Apple has kept versions of the Mac OS running on different CPUs in their labs, especially since the switch to OS X. Do you have any evidence to back up your supposition?http://lowendmac.com/orchard/05/0613.html
donlphi
Sep 25, 11:01 AM
So... what are we supposed to run this monstrosity on? The G5 QUADS had a hard enough time running the first one. I can't imagine running this on an iMac or worse... a mac mini.
JOKE JOKE JOKE
JOKE JOKE JOKE
MacRumors
Apr 25, 11:44 AM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/04/25/photo-of-iphone-4s-with-larger-screen/)
http://images.macrumors.com/article/2011/04/25/123044-ee164ce60334b6df3bb8-LL.jpg
Funny comic book: Hose ride
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err404
May 2, 11:36 AM
your correct, based on Steve Jobbs response to this which was pure BS we can never trust that the files do NOT get sent out.
Apple has been open about collecting location data. However that does does not come from consolidated.db. The database that everyone is talking about is data sent FROM Apple TO your phone. Why would Apple collect the data that they sent to you?
The issue is that if your phone is compromised by a third party, this DB could be used to infer information about your location (you location is not directly stored in the DB). The changes being made reduce this risk by shortening the cache and encrypting the data.
Apple has been open about collecting location data. However that does does not come from consolidated.db. The database that everyone is talking about is data sent FROM Apple TO your phone. Why would Apple collect the data that they sent to you?
The issue is that if your phone is compromised by a third party, this DB could be used to infer information about your location (you location is not directly stored in the DB). The changes being made reduce this risk by shortening the cache and encrypting the data.
minnesotamacman
Sep 12, 06:16 AM
Daffy Duck is from Warner, not Disney.
Good point! I think that would be Donald Duck who is friends with Mickey.
Good point! I think that would be Donald Duck who is friends with Mickey.
mmcc
Mar 29, 09:00 AM
I wrote:
I say again, the Mac App Store has depressed the sales volume and gross in my category for everyone. This is not a success in the sense of encouraging a vibrant and growing Mac software market. I felt that before the Mac App Store opened that the Mac software market was reaching a critical mass and that developers found it increasingly attractive.
Part of the previous appeal of the Mac software market to developers was the fact that Apple customers would accept increased costs for Mac software titles just as Apple charges a premium for its hardware because "it is worth it." Developers could coattail onto this and therefore ask higher prices for Mac software as compared to equivalent titles on other OS's.
Once the Mac App Store opened, that premium pricing advantage was wiped out overnight. Apple customers now expect to pay less just as the mobile App Store has reduced app pricing -- and in many cases expecting equivalent prices from the iPhone to the Mac desktop.
Do not underestimate this effect on developer's bottom lines.
I say again, the Mac App Store has depressed the sales volume and gross in my category for everyone. This is not a success in the sense of encouraging a vibrant and growing Mac software market. I felt that before the Mac App Store opened that the Mac software market was reaching a critical mass and that developers found it increasingly attractive.
Part of the previous appeal of the Mac software market to developers was the fact that Apple customers would accept increased costs for Mac software titles just as Apple charges a premium for its hardware because "it is worth it." Developers could coattail onto this and therefore ask higher prices for Mac software as compared to equivalent titles on other OS's.
Once the Mac App Store opened, that premium pricing advantage was wiped out overnight. Apple customers now expect to pay less just as the mobile App Store has reduced app pricing -- and in many cases expecting equivalent prices from the iPhone to the Mac desktop.
Do not underestimate this effect on developer's bottom lines.
LastLine
Nov 23, 04:56 PM
Should work anywhere from date of first use/registration:rolleyes:
That's a yes then? :P
That's a yes then? :P
Erwin-Br
May 3, 05:47 PM
So maybe, just maybe you fandroids out there, Apple had the foresight to design an ecosystem that just works and do it the right way.
Sorry to shatter your illusion, but my friend doesn't have Personal Hotspot on his iPhone because his Telco removed the feature. So how is this different and better from Android, huh? At least on Android you can still easily circumvent it without hacking or jail braking.
Sorry to shatter your illusion, but my friend doesn't have Personal Hotspot on his iPhone because his Telco removed the feature. So how is this different and better from Android, huh? At least on Android you can still easily circumvent it without hacking or jail braking.
DeSnousa
Apr 13, 04:44 PM
Oh yeah thanks to your help in getting the SMP client and giving the GPU client a go, I am now in the top 20 producers. Not bad considering when a few years back I had only an iBook and I was producing 48 points a day and did that for over a year!
I don't know how long I will be able to sustain that rate though might have to drop back.
I don't know how long I will be able to sustain that rate though might have to drop back.
radiohead14
Apr 16, 04:28 AM
Apple's success is in large part driven by the ecosystem that they have built around iPod/iTunes/iPhone/iPad. Good luck to anyone breaking into that anytime soon. The day I can buy a song on Mac/PC, synch it to my Android phone, then stream it around my home to HiFi or TV then we will have a competitor. Apple knows it, the record companies and studios know it, someone needs to tell Google.
What a shame. I really like Android OS but one of my biggest complaints by far is the lack of a solid service to sync and play music with my phone/tablet.
already exists - Amazon Cloud/Music Player
What a shame. I really like Android OS but one of my biggest complaints by far is the lack of a solid service to sync and play music with my phone/tablet.
already exists - Amazon Cloud/Music Player
Chupa Chupa
Dec 14, 07:37 AM
Story lost me when it said Jobs was upset that LTE won't be widely available this summer. I don't recall either ATT or Verizon ever giving a rosy scenario that that would be the case and I don't think Jobs would have that expectation of a brand new tech rollout that involves a lot more than just pushing out product.
Sedulous
May 3, 05:15 PM
I don't really get this... You already pay fees for the data - why do they care for how you use it?
I have been wondering the same thing. How can providers dictate how data is utilized by a customer? The data block is bough and paid for, the phone does the routing, so then how is an additional fee justified?
I have been wondering the same thing. How can providers dictate how data is utilized by a customer? The data block is bough and paid for, the phone does the routing, so then how is an additional fee justified?
KnightWRX
Mar 25, 06:21 AM
Happy BD keynote?!
They didn't even put up a small square on their Mac sub-page.
I do hope OS X still has a good 10 years in front of it. The best of both worlds for Unix people.
They didn't even put up a small square on their Mac sub-page.
I do hope OS X still has a good 10 years in front of it. The best of both worlds for Unix people.
ju5tin81
Sep 12, 07:37 AM
Not gonna happen. Apple will let you watch in the living room, it will just be via wireless streaming.
Damn! It would've given them the edge over Amazons 'unbox' thing and made them seem fairer... Ah well...
As long as there are no big 'WARNING' screens that you can't skip through like on a DVD disc....
Damn! It would've given them the edge over Amazons 'unbox' thing and made them seem fairer... Ah well...
As long as there are no big 'WARNING' screens that you can't skip through like on a DVD disc....
SiliconAddict
Oct 3, 03:27 PM
All I can say is whatever "top secret" features Leopard has better blow me out of my socks, threw the wall, and across my yard. As it stands. Meh.
iTV will be mine though as long as I can hook up an external HD to it to store video. If not. Pass.
iTV will be mine though as long as I can hook up an external HD to it to store video. If not. Pass.
SandynJosh
Mar 28, 05:11 PM
This is kind of rough. Shame it's heading this way.
Think about it. If MS Office is too large to sell through the App Store, then Apple avoids the dubious situation where it needs to offer the award to Microsoft. :)
Think about it. If MS Office is too large to sell through the App Store, then Apple avoids the dubious situation where it needs to offer the award to Microsoft. :)
oceans777
Apr 8, 07:02 PM
I got my iPad 2 at the magical store. CompUSA. Winner.
Lyra
Aug 2, 05:26 AM
So a ratio isn't necessarily a ratio, then? It depends on the population size?
You are aiming at being impossible right now...
A ratio doesn't always mean what people want it to mean... Simple as that...
It is all about how you twist and turn the results...
People talk, about how many voted for Bush and actually like him, or how many people hate Bush and wish he wasn't president... Which do you think dominates the US networks?
Shall we talk about statistics now?
Cause I would hate to go off topic...
Let us just stick to the main subject here.
Explain to me why you people feel threatened, harmed or hurt by the DRM?
How does it affect you?
What would you like if it wasn't there?
And what kind of reality would suit you best?
Make a case here so we can understand why you are so hung up on this crusade...
You are aiming at being impossible right now...
A ratio doesn't always mean what people want it to mean... Simple as that...
It is all about how you twist and turn the results...
People talk, about how many voted for Bush and actually like him, or how many people hate Bush and wish he wasn't president... Which do you think dominates the US networks?
Shall we talk about statistics now?
Cause I would hate to go off topic...
Let us just stick to the main subject here.
Explain to me why you people feel threatened, harmed or hurt by the DRM?
How does it affect you?
What would you like if it wasn't there?
And what kind of reality would suit you best?
Make a case here so we can understand why you are so hung up on this crusade...
thworple
Oct 19, 09:49 AM
I would love to know what the worldwide figure is for Apple market percentage. I know it says here that its not in the top 5, hence no available data, but it would be interesting to see, particularly here in the UK, as the amount of people I know who have switched in the last year has been huge!!
ssteve
Oct 6, 12:18 PM
Except Verizon does that too!!!!
Are you amongst tall buildings when you experience these dropped calls on Verizon? Maybe Verizon drops these calls because of the same reason AT&T does....
Don't get me wrong. I won't get an iPhone until I can get it on Verizon. I live in AZ and there are only two small spots where I ever lose a call and most of the time when I am in these areas, the calls do not drop.
Verizon...Get the iPhone.
Are you amongst tall buildings when you experience these dropped calls on Verizon? Maybe Verizon drops these calls because of the same reason AT&T does....
Don't get me wrong. I won't get an iPhone until I can get it on Verizon. I live in AZ and there are only two small spots where I ever lose a call and most of the time when I am in these areas, the calls do not drop.
Verizon...Get the iPhone.
alent1234
Apr 8, 12:43 PM
ok, now i can go back to best buy. they aren't evil anymore and the sales people are the most knowledgeable i've seen
illegalfrogs
Apr 16, 09:52 AM
I think it could be real. Apple seems to be trying to get away from plastic in their more pretentious, pro-level products. I can see the high-end iPhone being this, with an aluminum body, and the low end $99 model becoming the plastic 3GS. (Similar to the plastic MacBook Consumer model and aluminum MacBook Pro arrangement). They also banned screen protectors and seem to insist don't need anything to protect your iPhone... the metal back would appear more durable. Some people have also been clamoring for a return to original 2G iPhone looks. Maybe they found a way to route cell reception through the front so they can fry our brains even further (creating more Apple zealot zombies in the process).
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